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Unread postby fla-gypsy on Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:33 pm

The "Other" forum is having one of their special nights where everything works wrong. I am so thankful I can come here and post and know it is going to function correctly.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby PrivatePilot on Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:23 pm

I can't post a reply..wheeeee.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:32 pm

Hats off to you my friend, you have put together a very reliable forum
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:48 pm

PrivatePilot wrote:I can't post a reply..wheeeee.



LOL! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:44 am

How many portals do you have bookmarked over there?

If it gets slow in one, I usually can go to one of the less popular entries.

My connection is not high speed, so I prefer to go in earlier in the morning when fewer are on.

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby cwit on Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:39 am

I was on the other forum last night and quit because I could not go anyware. :) Our forum always seem to work. :D
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Gunship Guy on Fri Nov 21, 2008 4:59 pm

RV.net (yeah, I said the name!!) is going down hill in a hurry.

Dismal reliability aside, the people they choose to moderate some of the forums have taken their "job" to a whole new level of arrogance.

A large number of threads are being locked down for unknown reasons. Free discussion is rapidly disappearing. Occasionally, a moderator will make a statement that begs for a reply but then locks down the thread quickly so nobody can do that. To me, that's cowardly.

This morning someone posted a very good thread about sending Christmas cards to the troops at Walter Reed. Their only sin was posting it in the Class A forum instead of Around The Campfire. Instead of simply moving the thread to ATC, the Class A moderator deleted the whole thing without explanation. When I questioned this the moderator of ATC made false accusations that I posted the incorrect Walter Reed address and that I incorrectly posted the thread in the Class A forum. I wasn't the original poster so putting it in the Class A forum was not of my doing. Also, I made the statement that sending cards to troops at Walter Reed was a good thing. I never gave out an address for Walter Reed. Even in a PM the moderator continued accusing me of these things. I don't get it. He still had the entire thread to view yet wouldn't concede that the specific info was posted by someone else.

Unless you share the same views of the moderators over at RV.net you risk having your thoughts censored. I've witnessed this with other posters and have conversed via PM's with some who are just flabbergasted by the PM's they get from some of the more idiotic moderators.

RV.net is not what it use to be years ago. Newcomers ask a question and 87 know-it-alls berate them for not being instant experts. Post in the wrong forum and the offender is ridiculed.

The ONLY reason I still visit that site is because there are many I like to converse with who have not made their way over here yet. Escapees.com is another good forum where angry exchanges just don't seem to exist.

Anybody else see these things of which I speak?
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Fri Nov 21, 2008 5:22 pm

This is a cycle at rv.net.

The mod I encounter most often said 'pm Admin.' a number of times, rather than discuss something with him. Finally, he closed a thread because I had taken it 'off on a detour'. Then I did pm Admin pointing out that some leeway is essential or people get discouraged.

And afterwards, about a week afterwards another member started a thread on those things I'd been trying ask about.

IMO rv.net got too big and has it's own software programmed. It's too different from other forum software. Many times better and more user friendly, but badly in need of wholesale revamping. The same way much of MS software uses far too much memory since it is built on earlier ghosts.

Because of its longevity it still has a store of information greater than others. This is especially true for Truck Campers, and probably also for other small rigs in North America. Larger rigs tend to dominate and outlooks differ from those who choose smaller rigs. The stuff we do is different.

Still, other sites tend to be much more open to letting discussion go where it will and that makes them more friendly. I know one who gave up on rv.net, not for the usual reasons of software things to get around or strict adherence to topic, but because people didn't say thank you. Well, that's what he told me.

This is to say, and I'm sure Skip will remember too, the last time there was a big exodus like now was June 4, 2004. Same story all over again.

:)
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Fri Nov 21, 2008 5:58 pm

Gunship Guy wrote:RV.net (yeah, I said the name!!) is going down hill in a hurry.

Dismal reliability aside, the people they choose to moderate some of the forums have taken their "job" to a whole new level of arrogance.

A large number of threads are being locked down for unknown reasons. Free discussion is rapidly disappearing. Occasionally, a moderator will make a statement that begs for a reply but then locks down the thread quickly so nobody can do that. To me, that's cowardly.

This morning someone posted a very good thread about sending Christmas cards to the troops at Walter Reed. Their only sin was posting it in the Class A forum instead of Around The Campfire. Instead of simply moving the thread to ATC, the Class A moderator deleted the whole thing without explanation. When I questioned this the moderator of ATC made false accusations that I posted the incorrect Walter Reed address and that I incorrectly posted the thread in the Class A forum. I wasn't the original poster so putting it in the Class A forum was not of my doing. Also, I made the statement that sending cards to troops at Walter Reed was a good thing. I never gave out an address for Walter Reed. Even in a PM the moderator continued accusing me of these things. I don't get it. He still had the entire thread to view yet wouldn't concede that the specific info was posted by someone else.

Unless you share the same views of the moderators over at RV.net you risk having your thoughts censored. I've witnessed this with other posters and have conversed via PM's with some who are just flabbergasted by the PM's they get from some of the more idiotic moderators.

RV.net is not what it use to be years ago. Newcomers ask a question and 87 know-it-alls berate them for not being instant experts. Post in the wrong forum and the offender is ridiculed.

The ONLY reason I still visit that site is because there are many I like to converse with who have not made their way over here yet. Escapees.com is another good forum where angry exchanges just don't seem to exist.

Anybody else see these things of which I speak?


I have seen it many times also. I have been deleted and threatened so many times now for making critical remarks on performance or over moderation that it has become quite routine for me. Along with that the mods now have their hordes of munchkins who attack you on cue if you dare question anything. I find myself going less and less and really don't get near as much from it as I did at one time. It is a shame because it has such a large readership. The over moderation has gotten downright nasty at times with mods who think they are the thought police. The arrogance there is alarming.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby PrivatePilot on Fri Nov 21, 2008 6:01 pm

We're here with arms open - the reliability issues over at RV.net (there, I said it too) were one of the primary reasons I went out on a limb an setup this forum.

Yes, there are other forums out there, and yes, some are busier then we are, but I think that we have many features that put us ahead from a forum software and layout/operability standpoint. We certainly have a server that is capable of handling hundreds, even thousands of members online at once without much of a problem, and I do hope to see it get to that point eventually.

Our current moderators have been careful chosen, future ones will be equally selected, and we do have a clear "code of conduct" and expectations that are clearly laid out in the moderator forum so that there is no issues. Moderation is fair and thought out, not off-the-cuff and often biased depending on the moderators actual viewpoint (right or wrong), or based on personal issues with certain members.

That said, getting "attached" to a new forum (such as our) is a big step for many, especially when there are other choices. We aim to be a good home for all, and will prove ourselves as time goes on.

Feel free to invite any and all over here - we've got lots of room to grow.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Fri Nov 21, 2008 6:42 pm

It is getting rough over there today, problem is getting worse and many are complaining, the post deletion is in high gear. What a farce
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:01 pm

As PP says: Moderation is fair and thought out, not off-the-cuff and often biased depending on the moderators actual viewpoint (right or wrong), or based on personal issues with certain members..

It certainly should be, here, and as a Mod I will always do my best to adhere to this principle!

I too have suffered from the Mod's attitudes over there, have had posts deleted and edited for no just reason and have even had threatening PMs from a couple of members over there - so I too feel the pain and have vowed to myself that I will never get like that. Fair and firm, yes. But overbearing and power crazy, definitely not. I love this place and it is great to see our community growing - slowly but surely. :)
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby mikhen on Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:04 pm

I won't reply to some forums over there because I know the mods are watching and waiting. I have been deleted on a few topics and still can't figure out why. This place is just fine. A much more friendly and laid back place to hang out.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby catmom on Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:08 pm

This is definitely a friendlier forum, overall - not that I haven't encountered some friendly, helpful folks over there (at least one of whom invited me here)! I did have a post deleted recently - can't remember now what it was about, but it seemed innocuous enough. However, a couple of the mods that I've encountered have been ok, so it isn't all bad.

I mostly go over there because of the wealth of information (which comes from its being a large forum with lots of members). I did invite a few friendly folks from rv.net over here, and one or two came, but haven't been on much lately. Guess we can all get busy with other things in life from time to time... ;)

Anyway, thanks for the warm welcome over here!
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Gunship Guy on Sat Nov 22, 2008 12:04 pm

Most of the people on rv.net are fine folks. I don't care if someone disagrees with me in a post because I can simply give my point of view. What is wrong is when a moderator stirs the pot then locks down the thread so others can't respond. As I said before, that's cowardly. The moderator of the Around The Campfire forum does this.

I noticed that he has since removed the entire thread where I confronted him and asked if that was the level of assistance we can expect from him in the future. Guess he doesn't want anyone questioning his actions.

Several people have been asking "what happened to the thread about sending cards to wounded vets?" Every time it's posted a moderator deletes the entire thread. Happened 3 times yesterday.

Many members of rv.net are vets, are on active duty presently, or have friends/relatives serving. This anti-troop agenda by at least 2 moderators is disturbing.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby cwit on Sat Nov 22, 2008 4:24 pm

I go to the other forum as catmom says for info, but it's getting hard to find .Most info I needed I got here and on crossroads.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby jp rver on Sat Nov 22, 2008 4:54 pm

I have to agree with much that has already been stated about that forum. Some mods do a wonderful job, yet others have a hair trigger on the delete and threadlock buttons. I have been deleted and had my posts edited many times over there for some of the silliest things. And the sporadic episodes of site trouble can be very annoying.

This forum is great, and a welcome place to come to when the problems over there get out of hand. I have invited several from there to come here and many of them have joined us here.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Sat Nov 22, 2008 5:33 pm

Just a question for those here.

How many of you were members of rv.net as of Jan 1, 2004?

Skip, I think you were. I tried hunting some names and didn't find you all.

How you see this issue is bound to be different, if you were a member then. There was quite the exodus of folks in June 2004. Those who were around will know why.

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby jp rver on Sat Nov 22, 2008 5:47 pm

I was not there then. I joined that site in Sept. of 2005.

Would you care to elaborate? Sounds like a good story! :D
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Sat Nov 22, 2008 5:52 pm

I didn't show up on RV.net until April 05. Sure would like to hear the story though.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Sat Nov 22, 2008 8:15 pm

fla-gypsy wrote:I didn't show up on RV.net until April 05. Sure would like to hear the story though.


Me too! - I joined in October 2004. Must have just missed what happened!
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby catmom on Sun Nov 23, 2008 12:25 am

I didn't show up on RV.net until April 05.
That's about when we came in as well, perhaps a couple months later. It was right around when we bought our hybrid.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Sun Nov 23, 2008 8:38 am

Ok, I shall try. It is the reason why some topics are taboo, for example, politics and religion (see rv.net rules)

I call it the era of the nasties, but mind you I agree with Colin Powell re. attack ads. My way of putting it is that when they are demeaning to those attacked they not only go too far but are grounds for a court case or so.

There are those who had fun with what was going down, or it wouldn't have happened. At least one of those who had fun is here.

I showed up via google on the camper purchase hunt in December, 2003. I came for information and didn't find all the sections right away. At that time the membership was 67,000 or so. Often and often I'd read 'now don't flame me'. & of course, there were those who posted with very negative words. When I did find ATC, it seemed to me that those campfires didn't need any wood or charcoal to cook the food. The verbal invective of many participants, in fact some very slippery semantic eels, would fry all the food around. I didn't like it at all and did very little with ATC at that time.

Like everyone else I made friendships at that time that are very active today. It gave me courage to post. When I found things I thought I could answer, I answered. & well do I remember getting courage together to answer one who brought a 5er into Canada and flamed the country on the thread. One example there is: CBC was not worth listening to as it voiced the government viewpoint and so forth. One who did participate in ATC made a sort of apologetic post after me. !!!!!! Aplogizing for Canada and things Canadian???? PackerBacker, the moderator at the time, let my post stand. Quite few members also found ways to say, 'let's be more civil'.

In June, 2004 the rv.net management brought in new rules. There were weeks of warning. The guts of the rules were posted on all sections of rv.net. It took awhile to get used to.

Still when the new rules came into effect many, many, many reacted as if there had been no notice. Threads ran that must have kept mods extremely busy, letting discussion go on, but deleting. I'm sure there are still shadows. One who persisted in attacking those who disagreed with him was still a member until about 1.5 years ago.

The reaction of 'rv.net is going to far' led to other forums springing up. A number claim to have no moderation and see no need for it. I used to have list of the hotter ones. I know some of those continue. At least one died. I was a member there, probably still am. The CEO was one who had just about the highest number of posts around rv.net pre June 2004. Like it or not, he always seemed to have one who's view point he didn't like at a time. About 2 years ago a group from that place created a new place.

I'm sure there are places I've never heard of that came from the same events. & if the events are repeating themselves, more rving forums will develop.

As I said at the start, there are those who had fun 'lending spice' to the discussion. They will have different memories.

8-)

Ooops, I meant to say it seemed to me the rate of growth @ rv.net increased after the new rules came in.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Fire Instructor on Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:12 am

I didn't join there until 2006, so I "missed" the 2004 events, too. When I joined there, it seemed like a natural extension of my purchasing anything that I needed for camping from Camping World, and CW was a big sponsor of their's back then. As I recall, there was a bit of "turmoil" when CW dropped their sponsorship. Because of their much bigger membership, I may go there to get information on a topic, product, or destination, but I typically bring it back here (or to the Rockwood forum) to discuss it with reasonable and intelligent folks who don't flame you for asking a question, or tell you that you are a jackarse just for asking!
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:50 pm

LK - thanks for explaining! Now we know :)
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby PrivatePilot on Sun Nov 23, 2008 6:44 pm

I came along long after all of that, so I had no idea.

But...that said, it's damn near impossible to say that "You cannot discuss this" on any forum and have much success with it. The best effort, even if it's off topic to the forum (as politics would be on an RV forum) is to create a subforum specifically for it, limit it to that specific forum (so that people who don't want to read it don't have to) and deal with it there. Have rules in place, but embrace the topic if it brings traffic to the forum.

At a few points this past summer when we were all paying through the nose for gas I remember that they tried to make a moratorium on gas price threads, and we all know how well that went. I'll agree that we didn't need 20 new threads every hour across ever single forum, but there was ways to deal with it - personally I would have setup a temporary subforum specifically for it and let people vent all they want there! When the subforum became unnecessary in longer, merge the contents into the archives of the general forum, and close the temporary forum.

It's all in how proactive (instead of reactive) the administration and moderation is there.

As for the problems that some potentially problematic/heated threads like Politics can cause, We have a "Friends and Foes" system that allows members to block others if they so choose, and if a certain member was particularly problematic we also have other tools in our arsenal (behind the scenes) that would let us easily deal with the issue out of the public eye.

Again, it comes back to the experience of the administration on how issues like this are handled. Anyone who had any sort of long term experience with that sort of situation would embrace it, not piss off the entire membership and face an exodus over trying to squash it. It seems that's what happened there.

I'd be *happy* to offer a politics section over here if anyone was interested. It might be interesting, actually. I'd need to mull over how to manage it though before jumping in.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby catmom on Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:22 am

I don't know - politics is of course quite interesting, but usually involves some passionate feelings. I think I'd rather stay friends with folks here. :)
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby jp rver on Mon Nov 24, 2008 1:57 am

Yes, I have always believed that in order to remain friends, there are three topics you should avoid. Politics, religion, and which brand of vehicle is the best. :lol:

To Little Kopit, thanks for the explanation. I think there are still a couple members over there who like to stir it up quite a bit, especially in the ATC forum. The big 3 bailout issue is getting pretty heated over there today, and a couple threads had to be locked down.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:46 am

There were 2 threads that went un moderated over there that turned political and got ugly in a hurry. It is funny how threads like that will draw you into the fray even when you didn't go there with that intent. I ended up posting 2 or 3 times to some of the nastier stuff. They disappeared later with no explanation of course. I say we stay away from it, North American politics is in a tumultuous state currently.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:05 am

I agree - I'd rather not have political discussions here, even if there was a separate area for it - who would want to draw the short straw and moderate that one! :o
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:43 am

Limey wrote:I agree - I'd rather not have political discussions here, even if there was a separate area for it - who would want to draw the short straw and moderate that one! :o


Only PP could do that.

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Zinger on Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:10 pm

while a political section might be interesting I personally think it could put people in a not so nice frame of mind we dont have problems now but I think we could if we talked politics or religion there are forums for just that. The only politics we need here is what camper is better. answer is the kind you own and enjoy.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Fire Instructor on Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:17 pm

I vote that we stay away from sex, religion, politics, race, and Dodge vs. Ford, vs. Chevy vs. Toyota.

If you want those discussions, just log on to your local "Lunatic Louge", otherwise known as the Rant and Rave section of your local Craigslist!
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Zinger on Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:22 pm

Fire Instructor wrote:I vote that we stay away from sex, religion, politics, race, and Dodge vs. Ford, vs. Chevy vs. Toyota.

If you want those discussions, just log on to your local "Lunatic Louge", otherwise known as the Rant and Rave section of your local Craigslist!


:lol: :lol: :lol: Come on Rich we all know Ford is better than Dodge :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Fire Instructor on Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:44 pm

Only on that oxygen deprived mountain-side that you live on! :mrgreen:

DW and I went by early Sunday afternoon, on the way to her Cuz's house. I didn't see you outside, or I would have stopped.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Zinger on Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:48 pm

you have relatives in this oxygen deprived end of the county? How was the excursion last sat? how many fit5's did you buy?
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Tue Nov 25, 2008 11:34 pm

I may own a Dodge now, but I still say Toyota's have better quality.

& the quality of any of them doesn't match that of those made for Europeans or Australians. Theres a good thread that has been running in TC section @ rv.net. - partly because some from both of those places have been taking part in it

So, debate over buggies has to stay as being to heavily related to rving.

;)
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby cwit on Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:39 am

Crossroads has truck wars and if you take it as fun then that is what it is .Politics should be forbidding for ever. :D
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:42 am

cwit wrote:Crossroads has truck wars and if you take it as fun then that is what it is .Politics should be forbidding for ever. :D


No, I didn't say that. But the merits of various vehicles for different rving tasks is essential to talking about rving.

Anyone who does any checking can't help but find out that both AU and EU trucks are more rugged than N. American trucks. & of course, I wish it were the other way around.

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Wed Nov 26, 2008 1:12 pm

We don't have trucks in England we have Lorries!! :mrgreen:
GSTQ :)
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Wed Nov 26, 2008 1:46 pm

Yeah, and they are Utes in Oz.

Of course, you may be passed by the Coach and that doesn't mean a person has approved of you either, it just means a bus is trying to keep to his/her time on the company route.

Lorry is the same beast for hauling a camper or pulling a 'caravan'/travel trailer (N.AM), camper trailer (Oz).

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Fire Instructor on Wed Nov 26, 2008 2:11 pm

Little Kopit wrote:Yeah, and they are Utes in Oz.


Famous line: "What's a Ute?"
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Wed Nov 26, 2008 3:38 pm

Utility.

:D
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Limey on Wed Nov 26, 2008 6:50 pm

Fire Instructor wrote:
Little Kopit wrote:Yeah, and they are Utes in Oz.


Famous line: "What's a Ute?"


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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Sat Nov 29, 2008 10:11 pm

I swear the moderation is out of control over there. I am losing about 10% of my posts every day now. Gee Whiz you can't even make fun of California now.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:36 am

Speaking as a Canuck, I have always found posts with anything a bit down on Canada sit and survive many times more than the other way around.

Have you tried sending a pm to Admin. I'm not that sure how much good it does, but I think it must to do some.

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Gunship Guy on Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:36 am

"Admin" over on rv.net is no better than any other moderator on that site. Maybe worse.

A few years ago he sent me a PM asking me to remove a spiritual quote from my signature. When I questioned him on it he stated that references to God are not allowed on rv.net. When I replied that there are numerous signatures with references to God on rv.net and why was mine being viewed differently, I was just told again to remove it.

I am often critical of Trailer Life magazine (a worthless rag, IMO) so maybe that had something to do with him singling me out.

Admin and the Moderators will back each other up no matter what. Complaining to Admin about a moderator will only generate a cordial reply from him but will serve no useful purpose.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Little Kopit on Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:15 pm

Well, I have gotten positive responses from her on occasion, Admin I mean.

I can see the reference to God being interpreted as a discussion of religion. And for all we know it could have come from Affinity.

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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Gunship Guy on Sun Nov 30, 2008 6:44 pm

If the statement in my signature was interpreted as a religious discussion then Affinity allows such discussions. They allow it because people currently have religious statements in their sigs and they are going unchallenged.

Admin and the moderators practice selective enforcement of forum rules on a daily basis. This was discussed at length during a recent forum town hall-style meeting on rv.net. A common mindset among the moderators is "it's Affinity's website and they can do whatever they want". That's true. And they ARE doing whatever they want regardless of their own forum guidelines. This is why many are getting angry with Affinity. Affinity needs to remember we are potential customers. They need us. We don't need them.
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby fla-gypsy on Sun Nov 30, 2008 9:53 pm

Gunship Guy wrote:If the statement in my signature was interpreted as a religious discussion then Affinity allows such discussions. They allow it because people currently have religious statements in their sigs and they are going unchallenged.

Admin and the moderators practice selective enforcement of forum rules on a daily basis. This was discussed at length during a recent forum town hall-style meeting on rv.net. A common mindset among the moderators is "it's Affinity's website and they can do whatever they want". That's true. And they ARE doing whatever they want regardless of their own forum guidelines. This is why many are getting angry with Affinity. Affinity needs to remember we are potential customers. They need us. We don't need them.


I am not so sure Affinity has anything to do with it. More like Admin and his/her mod cohorts are deciding what/and who they like and dislike
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Re: Other forum

Unread postby Gunship Guy on Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:09 pm

Agree to a point.

I believe I saw it during the town hall meeting where one of the mods or Admin made the comment that people from Affinity monitor rv.net and make inputs "behind the scenes".

Anyway, when I made the comment about Affinity I'm speaking about everyone under the Company thumb...Admin and mods...since they are operating the forum under Affinity's direction.
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